An Interview with Children’s Booksellers Margaret Wallace-Jones, Tony West and Mark Pembrey from The Alligator’s Mouth Children’s Bookshop in Richmond.
Mark Pembrey is a student on my City Lit ‘Writing for Children Workshop’ course, and kindly brought along his colleagues, children’s book shop owners Margaret-Wallace Jones and Tony West so I could interview all three of them.
Margaret and Tony opened their independent bookshop, The Alligator’s Mouth, in Richmond, in 2015. The previous children’s book shop where they worked, The Lion and Unicorn had closed after thirty-six years due to rent rises.
According to Mark, ‘Margaret’s eye for high quality books and her determination to fight for children’s reading inspires staff and customers.’
Tony had also worked in Waterstones and prior to that he’d been a primary school teacher so had built up a great deal of book knowledge and expertise. According to Margaret:
‘He has a gift for bookselling and needed to continue and to use this gift!’
Mark came to them from Nomad Books, joining a few months before the shop opened.
‘Mark’s ideas and creativity bring in the business, getting people into the shop.’ (Margaret)
What are the biggest trends in children’s books right now?
The Alligator’s Mouth sells different books to big chains like Waterstones. Margaret, Tony and Mark choose the books they love, including those from smaller publishers and those that are hard to categorise. But there are some noticeable trends:
- Graphic novels: these are growing hugely and very important to sales.
- YA romantasy: this is another trend but not so much in this shop. The Romantasy trend is led by Tik Tok, so isn’t necessarily helping bookshops. Readers mainly get their books elsewhere.
- Gifty non-fiction: these high-quality beautiful books do well. Where non-fiction books mainly used photographs in the past, more are illustrated now.
- Highly specific Non-fiction: Unusual high specific books are popular like ‘The Shipwreck Atlas’ by Jo Arnold and Philip Harris.
- Climate Change: There are many books being published about climate change but they are not necessarily popular with readers.
- Inspiring Figures: this is another category where more children’s books are being published.
- Non-fiction with Infographics: these are books that include pie charts, Venn diagrams and statistics. This is a trend that has filtered down from adult books to children’s.
- Mental Health: Schools are increasingly requesting mental health books. There is a ‘Feelings and Situations’ section in the shop, that includes books to help children with anxiety and bereavement etc.
- Mindfulness in Picture Books: More picture books are being published that include mindfulness. ‘Your Mind is Like the Sky’ by Bronwen Ballard and ‘A Horse Called Now’ by Ruth Doyle and Alexandra Finkeldey are good examples of these. Children often prefer a good story that explores these themes without being specifically ‘about’ anxiety.
How have children’s books changed over the years?
Books have become more beautiful. Graphic novels have expanded for all ages. Teen/YA categories have expanded too. Books have become more accessible, easier to read, though one of Margaret’s complaints is that many middle grade fantasy books are still far too long.
Children’s books are more colloquial, with far less description than there used to be. They are story driven but have less sense of place.
In the last 20-25 years there has been a decline in novels that are not written in the first person. First person books are accessible but often lack richness and sometimes have terrible grammar. It might be what a child would say but reinforces poor grammar.
More Diversity
There is more diversity, including neurodiversity and more YA books with gay characters. It has taken a long time for black characters not to be refugees in books and to have more varied roles. There still aren’t enough boy characters and especially black boys.
Too many books focus on girls as they read more and there are a lot of orphan girls and girls looking for missing scientist mothers!
More early readers are being published; chunky, innovative books with high quality paper and lots of illustrations. Some great examples of these are ‘Nice Work for the Cat and the King’ by Nick Sharatt, ‘King Coo’ by Adam Stower and ‘Adventure Mice’ by Philip Reeve and Sarah McIntyre. More are still needed!
More Funny Books
There are many clever, witty books that are alternatives to Wimpy Kid. More funny books are needed – especially for YA.
Teachers today are looking for books that encourage empathy, bravery, resilience and a growth mindset.
What are parents and children looking for today?
Parents and children want books that are easy, quick to read and fun, books that take them into richly imagined worlds. While series are always popular, some specifically ask for stand-a-lone books.
People often come into the shop looking for advice. For children who love the Dog Man or Wimpy Kid books and Bunny vs Monkey, the booksellers can show them other options, encourage them to try something else they will enjoy.
Children like to be seen reading a series ‘that is cool to share’ or something ‘known about’ like the Minecraft books.
It’s not always easy for young people or their parents to tell what is suitable for them. Booksellers can guide them.
In the shop some middle grade books that are still suitable for teenagers are shelved in the Teen/YA section to encourage those readers to pick them up. ‘Wolf Hollow’ by Lauren Wolk and ‘Spellslinger’ by Sebastien de Castell are books that work well for younger secondary age children.
How do you see the role of independent bookshops in children’s reading?
This is far more than ‘a shop’. The Alligator’s Mouth holds many community events. Mark runs a QuickDraw comic club and there are also book clubs and story times. They work closely with local schools, host author visits and arrange them for schools.
‘I see my work providing comic drawing workshops to schools and venues as an extension of my work at The Alligator’s Mouth, keeping children excited about reading and telling stories with words and pictures.’ (Mark)
They also work with teachers in training from St Mary’s University. They’ve supplied books for a Prison Reading Group for family days and curated a list of books for children in the wake of the Grenfell Disaster.
Beanstalk volunteers bring children into the shop who’ve never been to a bookshop before. Schools also bring Yr 6 students into the shop, sometimes library monitors or pupil premium students.
The Alligator’s Mouth runs book clubs for 9-11s, and for home schooled children. There’s also an adventure game book club. On top of this the booksellers attend conferences for teachers, such as ‘Get Hounslow Reading’.
To celebrate books for 6-8s, Tony had the idea for ‘The Alligator’s Mouth Award’ which runs in conjunction with the Bright Agency and is awarded each year for a book published for 6–8-year-olds.
The winner this year is Bear and Bird: The Secret and Other Stories by Jarvis.
Are digital formats changing children’s reading habits?
The speed of scrolling is leading to shorter attention spans. Screens are changing their brains. But you can’t cuddle up with an e-book. Research has also shown that children absorb more from a physical book than from e-books.
As Mark says, ‘Having a physical book in your hand is a relationship, it’s important. You have the pleasure of holding the book and turning the physical page.’
What challenges are facing bookshops today?
The High Street is a changing eco-system and higher taxes/ business rates make things very hard. It would help if the Government recognised the value of physical retail, of independent shops. These things are getting harder and not easier. There is no recognition of the community service this shop and shops like it provide.
Margaret heard from a Korean bookseller that in South Korea bookshops and reading are seen as very important and schools have to buy books from their local independent bookshop. It is the law!
There is of course competition from online retailers. Some schools love to get an author in but then don’t buy books.
Looking ahead, how do you see the future of children’s books and bookshops?
Shops like The Alligator’s Mouth are at the heart of communities. They are place for conversations. People come in to say Hi, and to talk to the booksellers about their lives, as well as getting book recommendations.
While bookshop chains often select books for the whole chain, and publishers pay to have certain books on tables or in the window, Margaret, Tony and Mark are free to curate their own selections of children's books, choose what they want on their tables and make their own window displays.
A lot of exciting things are happening in children’s publishing. There are many beautifully produced, nicely illustrated books.
As Tony says, “Families want to give their children an advantage in life and a reading culture is the best way to do this.”
Parents and children do want real books
If the shift to reducing screen time for children continues, hopefully people will value ‘real life’ experiences more and want to be part of their local community and buy more books!
The shop will have activities running over the summer holidays. As it is, the events at The Alligator’s Mouth now usually sell out, which is something that didn’t happen in the past.
I am looking forward to visiting this wonderful shop soon myself and hope you will too!
Visit The Alligator’s Mouth
2A Church Court
Richmond
TW9 1JL
@alligatorsmouth
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